Annual General Meeting

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dixie chicken
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Re: Annual General Meeting

Post by dixie chicken » Thursday 09th 2017f November 2017 10:37:50 AM

It’s nothing to do with costs.
They have all the data within the Management Accounts which are quite sophisticated.
It would take nothing to supply an analysis of income and expenditure into the various constituent parts.
Foe example, it would be interesting to see what the pitch income is, especially as all the debt was paid off.
In fact, a few years ago, Andy Thomson produced a chart showing all the various sources of income and expenditure.
It’s not rocket science.

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Re: Annual General Meeting

Post by Sir Jones » Thursday 09th 2017f November 2017 07:14:27 PM

dixie chicken wrote:
Thursday 09th 2017f November 2017 10:37:50 AM
It’s nothing to do with costs.
They have all the data within the Management Accounts which are quite sophisticated.
It would take nothing to supply an analysis of income and expenditure into the various constituent parts.
Foe example, it would be interesting to see what the pitch income is, especially as all the debt was paid off.
In fact, a few years ago, Andy Thomson produced a chart showing all the various sources of income and expenditure.
It’s not rocket science.
I'm sure in the land of cowboy accounting you could do this on the cheap for statutory accounts but you wouldn't catch me risking my CA licence signing off on it without time taken on a full review.

I just read through the accounts today. Loss aside, for a snapshot in time, they read ok to me.
If you're committed enough, you can make any story work. I once told a woman I was Kevin Costner, and it worked because I believed it.

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Re: Annual General Meeting

Post by dixie chicken » Thursday 09th 2017f November 2017 08:15:01 PM

I don’t think they’re okay as the loss before transfer income is £666k and around £540k if you strip out depreciation.
You can’t expect transfer income on a regular basis.
As we’ve paid off all our debt we must be saving a lot on debt interest and yet to clock up such high losses is worrying.
We should be able to break even without transfer fee income and if not,what are the costs that are contributing to the losses?
I don’t see why the FD can’t provide some data showing where the losses are coming from.
Nothing to do with the Auditors who merely carry out their statutory duties.

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Re: Annual General Meeting

Post by kent brockman » Thursday 09th 2017f November 2017 08:44:34 PM

You don`t need to look very far to see where the losses are coming from.

We have the costs of a premier league club (players, coaches, staff, stadium etc) and the income of a championship club.

According to the accounts, we would have made a loss of around £625,000 had we not received transfer income of £325,000.
Its not the taking part that counts......its the WINNING.

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Re: Annual General Meeting

Post by dixie chicken » Thursday 09th 2017f November 2017 09:00:30 PM

One of the things I can’t quite get my head around is the stadium.
What do we own, if anything, and what is the set up vis a vis, the Council.
I’d love someone to explain it fully.
I know what we pay for the South Stand but do we pay rent for the rest?

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Re: Annual General Meeting

Post by dennybairn » Friday 10th 2017f November 2017 08:50:20 AM

dixie chicken wrote:
Thursday 09th 2017f November 2017 08:15:01 PM
I don’t think they’re okay as the loss before transfer income is £666k and around £540k if you strip out depreciation.
You can’t expect transfer income on a regular basis.
As we’ve paid off all our debt we must be saving a lot on debt interest and yet to clock up such high losses is worrying.
We should be able to break even without transfer fee income and if not,what are the costs that are contributing to the losses?
I don’t see why the FD can’t provide some data showing where the losses are coming from.
Nothing to do with the Auditors who merely carry out their statutory duties.
For fear of repeating myself and backing Jonesy up, ignore the P&L and focus on cash.
Let's hear it for the lovely ladies.

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Re: Annual General Meeting

Post by kent brockman » Friday 10th 2017f November 2017 09:17:03 AM

dixie chicken wrote:
Thursday 09th 2017f November 2017 09:00:30 PM
One of the things I can’t quite get my head around is the stadium.
What do we own, if anything, and what is the set up vis a vis, the Council.
I’d love someone to explain it fully.
I know what we pay for the South Stand but do we pay rent for the rest?
Yes, we pay an annual "rent" for our share of the costs of running the Falkirk Stadium.

The "rent" is paid to Falkirk Community Stadium Limited (FCSL) which is part of Falkirk Council

We own the offices on the ground floor as well as the pitch, dressing rooms, seating, floodlights etc

In addition we own the North Stand and we lease the South Stand from the South Stand Development Company.
Its not the taking part that counts......its the WINNING.

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Re: Annual General Meeting

Post by dixie chicken » Friday 10th 2017f November 2017 09:56:51 AM

dennybairn wrote:
Friday 10th 2017f November 2017 08:50:20 AM
dixie chicken wrote:
Thursday 09th 2017f November 2017 08:15:01 PM
I don’t think they’re okay as the loss before transfer income is £666k and around £540k if you strip out depreciation.
You can’t expect transfer income on a regular basis.
As we’ve paid off all our debt we must be saving a lot on debt interest and yet to clock up such high losses is worrying.
We should be able to break even without transfer fee income and if not,what are the costs that are contributing to the losses?
I don’t see why the FD can’t provide some data showing where the losses are coming from.
Nothing to do with the Auditors who merely carry out their statutory duties.
For fear of repeating myself and backing Jonesy up, ignore the P&L and focus on cash.

Don’t buy that.
You could have a shed full of cash but large creditors and little debtors.
A few months down the line you’ll be bust.
P&L is very important as it shows your performance whereas Balance Sheet (including Assets, liquid assets and current liabilities)is merely a snapshot at a particular time.
A poor trading year with no player sales will spell DISASTER.

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Re: Annual General Meeting

Post by dixie chicken » Friday 10th 2017f November 2017 09:58:40 AM

kent brockman wrote:
Friday 10th 2017f November 2017 09:17:03 AM
dixie chicken wrote:
Thursday 09th 2017f November 2017 09:00:30 PM
One of the things I can’t quite get my head around is the stadium.
What do we own, if anything, and what is the set up vis a vis, the Council.
I’d love someone to explain it fully.
I know what we pay for the South Stand but do we pay rent for the rest?
Yes, we pay an annual "rent" for our share of the costs of running the Falkirk Stadium.

The "rent" is paid to Falkirk Community Stadium Limited (FCSL) which is part of Falkirk Council

We own the offices on the ground floor as well as the pitch, dressing rooms, seating, floodlights etc

In addition we own the North Stand and we lease the South Stand from the South Stand Development Company.
Thanks KB.
Any idea how much we pay in “rent” to FCSL?

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Re: Annual General Meeting

Post by Brian Scrimegour » Friday 10th 2017f November 2017 12:28:52 PM

kent brockman wrote:
Friday 10th 2017f November 2017 09:17:03 AM
dixie chicken wrote:
Thursday 09th 2017f November 2017 09:00:30 PM
One of the things I can’t quite get my head around is the stadium.
What do we own, if anything, and what is the set up vis a vis, the Council.
I’d love someone to explain it fully.
I know what we pay for the South Stand but do we pay rent for the rest?
Yes, we pay an annual "rent" for our share of the costs of running the Falkirk Stadium.

The "rent" is paid to Falkirk Community Stadium Limited (FCSL) which is part of Falkirk Council

We own the offices on the ground floor as well as the pitch, dressing rooms, seating, floodlights etc

In addition we own the North Stand and we lease the South Stand from the South Stand Development Company.

So do we have no involvement then in fcsl?

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Re: Annual General Meeting

Post by kent brockman » Friday 10th 2017f November 2017 03:22:48 PM

No. The Falkirk Stadium is operated and managed by Falkirk Community Stadium Limited (FCSL), a wholly owned subsidiary of Falkirk Council.
Its not the taking part that counts......its the WINNING.

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Re: Annual General Meeting

Post by dennybairn » Saturday 11th 2017f November 2017 10:04:06 PM

dixie chicken wrote:
Friday 10th 2017f November 2017 09:56:51 AM
Don’t buy that.
You could have a shed full of cash but large creditors and little debtors.
A few months down the line you’ll be bust.
P&L is very important as it shows your performance whereas Balance Sheet (including Assets, liquid assets and current liabilities)is merely a snapshot at a particular time.
A poor trading year with no player sales will spell DISASTER.
And the P&L is ever so easily manipulated that it means very little.

In a previous role, I was in a business that was reporting a pretty strong P&L result each month, looked good on paper but the cash balance was rapidly depleting.

What was going on? Well the movements in the balance sheet were being manipulated to make the P&L look good.

How did I know? I was the one doing the manipulating. :lol:
Let's hear it for the lovely ladies.

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Re: Annual General Meeting

Post by Back Post Misses » Monday 13th 2017f November 2017 08:00:39 PM

dennybairn wrote:
Saturday 11th 2017f November 2017 10:04:06 PM
dixie chicken wrote:
Friday 10th 2017f November 2017 09:56:51 AM
Don’t buy that.
You could have a shed full of cash but large creditors and little debtors.
A few months down the line you’ll be bust.
P&L is very important as it shows your performance whereas Balance Sheet (including Assets, liquid assets and current liabilities)is merely a snapshot at a particular time.
A poor trading year with no player sales will spell DISASTER.
And the P&L is ever so easily manipulated that it means very little.

In a previous role, I was in a business that was reporting a pretty strong P&L result each month, looked good on paper but the cash balance was rapidly depleting.

What was going on? Well the movements in the balance sheet were being manipulated to make the P&L look good.

How did I know? I was the one doing the manipulating. :lol:
Not being an accountant but running a business I kind of agree with you both. Cash is king but in simple terms if (in my line of business anyway) I sell more than our cost of sales and overhead combined each month and I keep my stock pretty level my P&L profit will improve my cash position over time provided I don't have loads of bad debt.

In the football business it does seem very lumpy in terms of sales so cash has to be really important as you need the busy period (ST sales time) to cover the overhead over the months.

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Re: Annual General Meeting

Post by Olaf Thom » Thursday 23rd 2017f November 2017 08:12:00 PM

This is on Monday, need a good result on Saturday, otherwise this might get quite heated for an AGM.

Will be interesting, not been to one for a few years - hopefully make it along to this one
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Re: Annual General Meeting

Post by havenbairn » Monday 27th 2017f November 2017 10:26:06 PM

Doug Henderson survived a vote of no confidence from the shareholders present at tonight`s meeting.

The proposal to re-elect him to the Board was defeated on a show of hands but carried by the major shareholders after a card vote.

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Re: Annual General Meeting

Post by gruezi ffc » Monday 27th 2017f November 2017 10:42:56 PM

my summary for what its worth...

1. Andy Thomson put up more details on the cash generation and where we spend. Nothing of any real surprise in that we lost around £300k in the last financial year. We have around £400k still in the bank. Probably that will all be gone this season if we do not move up the league. Real issues if we get relegated. Brain Guthrie asked for these details to be handed out either before the AGM or at least as we went in. Andy was adamant that was not going to happen and that the shareholders would only get the statutory minimal.... a stramash followed.

2. I asked about the 4th stand. Looks as though we lost around £30k on that for a feasibility study that generated nothing. The job (and cash) was given to someone who knew the directors (*laugh - why am I not surprised ?). They then waffled on about it being "ongoing" and will revisit if and when the time is right.

3. Re-election of Doug Henderson. This was by far the most entertaining part of the night. Gordon Profit requested that a vote against him be considered. Margaret Lang indicated that might not need be the case until the club sec. piped up that the proxy vote was less than majority. There was a show of hands which was pretty much the majority "against" him being re-elected. His face was fizz !!!! A card vote was taken..but he got in due to the MSG voting for him. Blatant cronyism. At the end everyone was telling him to stand down, resign, GTF.... but he red necked it. However, it was pretty clear that he is not wanted.

4. Re-election of Kieran K - no issue and he got in unanimously

5. Paul Hartley - the expected questions about how we are so crap was fielded pretty diligently. He acknowledges that the balance of the side is totally out of kilter. Too many defenders and the size of the squad is too big. Conceded that confidence is low and that plays a part. Sibbs and Taiwo back in training with the 1st team tomorrow. ..... and what pleased the crowd.... he has been actively looking down south for players. He indicated he knew the Scottish scene and that there is nothing much available of the quality he would like. So he is "thinking out of the box" and looking much further afield. His hope is to have at least 4 new signings in January and has already been sounding them out.
Come the revolution......George will be first against the wall :D

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Re: Annual General Meeting

Post by rusty_nail » Monday 27th 2017f November 2017 11:17:49 PM

gruezi ffc wrote:
Monday 27th 2017f November 2017 10:42:56 PM
my summary for what its worth...
… So he is "thinking out of the box" and looking much further afield. His hope is to have at least 4 new signings in January and has already been sounding them out.
Thanks for the summary.

PH "box" must be a shoe box! Sean Welsh (Partick Thistle) playing as trial it's tonight in the U20s v Hearts.
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Re: Annual General Meeting

Post by A13FFC » Tuesday 28th 2017f November 2017 11:02:02 AM

By far the best AGM I have attended with some very good questions asked and in the main answered.

But sadly it all went to prove one thing, the clear message from the current MSG is "BACK IN YOUR BOX" to sit in the room and watch as nearly the entire room voted against Doug I bring feck all to the table Henderson all it took was 3 of the MSG to pass his appointment.

So when you hear the club talk of openness and transparency, and the requests for fresh investors or even better a, possible fans buy out. Just remember one thing. IT WILL ALWAYS BE ON THEIR TERMS!

How that man could sit in the room last night is beyond me, any person with even the slightest moral compass would have realised that his time at the club was over.
Support the team not the regime!!

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Re: Annual General Meeting

Post by Olaf Thom » Tuesday 28th 2017f November 2017 11:35:29 AM

I can only assume that Henderson must bring something, the major shareholders are wealthy businessmen who usually have a healthy dislike for meddling politicians. Why they want to keep this guy is a mystery? Maybe he stops the Labour Party in Falkirk screwing us?

Best news of the nigh was Hartley is on the road, hunting players, this has been my mantra since lazy bones Houston took over. Scottish players are crap, the good ones are all in the top 4 clubs, the rest are pish and you'd get better down south and abroad - Chapeau Hartley, get the Scottish dross out the club!
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Re: Annual General Meeting

Post by Brian Scrimegour » Tuesday 28th 2017f November 2017 12:32:32 PM

The Doug Henderson farce was an utter joke. Any decent person wouldve said okay I dont want to rock the boat I'll just stand down. Not our Doug though who ploughed on regardless and was voted on by his buddies in the MSG. Looks like more drunken stumblings on brexit for the next few years then.

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